tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post8660067424279246471..comments2024-03-26T17:31:58.290-07:00Comments on 'Fraidy Cat Eventing: how what why: Charlie + Ulcersemmahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05686949099663199382noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-8214842426606448462019-09-23T12:52:52.713-07:002019-09-23T12:52:52.713-07:00I'm so curious to see ow this all works out! U...I'm so curious to see ow this all works out! Ulcers are such a god damn mystery to me and I've never seen two horses react or recover in te same way or from te same treatment! It's definitely a puzzle that requires a lot of persistence on the owners part! Scout get's a little unlike himself this time of year too, and he had a bout of anaplasmosis last year around this time. Could be the hot weather that just won't stop... who knows! Niamhhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12445287419135378606noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-51631989630131499192019-09-22T19:20:55.902-07:002019-09-22T19:20:55.902-07:00Just to be different and stand out from the crowd ...Just to be different and stand out from the crowd - I think you and Charlie are doing well. Everyone gets down or disconnected from time to time. With what little information I have on the two of you from this blog, it sounds like you could just need to take a break. Rest does wonders. Jenna Blumerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16415862271375573914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-57435319592302173182019-09-20T13:53:04.820-07:002019-09-20T13:53:04.820-07:00So, June has had ulcers, and needed her teeth done...So, June has had ulcers, and needed her teeth done, so I guess all I'm missing is saddle fit issues? Luckily, treating the ulcers and floating the teeth resolved a lot of problems.<br />I need to look into products like Abgard and Nexxium, never even heard of them. <br />I THOUGHT that in order to effectively treat ulcers it was one tube of Gastrogard or Ulcergard per day for 28-30 days. Like, a full tube. I totally do a half tube for travel and stressful situations to help prevent, but I thought treatment needed a full tube. I may be wrong? <br />It seems like there are lots of options and it's just finding out what is best for your own horse and how the results turn out. I hope Charlie is feeling his best in no time!<br />nadiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08290914277204973015noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-19513051178631112582019-09-20T10:58:02.251-07:002019-09-20T10:58:02.251-07:00Jumping on this comment thread! The coating you re...Jumping on this comment thread! The coating you refer to is enteric coating, and I agree I don't think many generics (or human ready omeprazole) has that, so it's less effective for horses. Abgard has the coating, which I commented about below.<br /><br />After chatting with a Merial rep (folks that make ulcergard), they said the reason it is so expensive is because omeprazole for horses can be really tricky to keep from spoiling. So they developed a way to show when the product went bad- which is that the ulcer/gastrogard turns dark purple. If it's the normal greyish/whiteish color it's good. But developing a formula that has a longer shelf life and indicates when spoiled is the reason behind the $$$ and why no other company has created a competitive product.Britt at Red on the Righthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11199502848495130670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-35425941110192092482019-09-20T10:50:40.079-07:002019-09-20T10:50:40.079-07:00Oh shiiiiiiiiit. I could write a fucking novel on ...Oh shiiiiiiiiit. I could write a fucking novel on ulcers. Foster wasn't ulcery from a behavioral sense either, until of course those fuckers got to grade 4 status and then he got girthy. 10 weeks of ulcergard later... anyawys.<br /><br />What I want to share with you is that Smitty also got ulcers. Not wanting to spend a small fortune, I went with the Abgard (paste) and Succeed (supplement) for 6 weeks. He was scoped before (diagnosing the ulcers) and after (to confirm they were gone). And it worked. That's my anecdotal evidence for Abgard's efficacy.Britt at Red on the Righthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11199502848495130670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-5329038878993688792019-09-20T09:00:08.681-07:002019-09-20T09:00:08.681-07:00In 2017 P didn't have standard symptoms, but a...In 2017 P didn't have standard symptoms, but as a last ditch effort I had him scoped (since it's required for insurance) and it turned out he had the most severe ulcers (2/3 and 3/3 grade ulcers) and was on an extended dose of GG/Sucralfate, and was clear upon re-scope. Before, during and after the treatment I saw zero changes in P. He still hates baths and grooming, getting girthed up, still stopped at jumps (the reason I went the ulcer route ultimately)- nothing ever got better or worse with him.<br /><br />When I brought Leo home, I put him on 10 days of the full dose of GG then tapered off and while I can't say whether or not that made a difference in anything (since I didn't know him), I wanted to get off on the right foot. He doesn't mind brushing or bathing, doesn't particularly enjoy being tacked up, but nothing screams ulcers to me. <br /><br />That being said, I'm going to talk to my vet about doing a treatment plan similar to yours just to see, since he travels alot (alone also) and I think that if he didn't have them before, that leaving him inside all night alone with no hay/water (requirement pre-scoping), he'd definitely develop them because of that!<br /><br />Keep us updated on how C does!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-27280194627830791712019-09-20T06:59:11.494-07:002019-09-20T06:59:11.494-07:00My horse before May developed ulcers. He had a hig...My horse before May developed ulcers. He had a high forage diet. Probably not as much turnout as he would have liked, but quite a bit. His symptoms?<br />- minor colic episodes<br />- slightly spooky<br /><br />yeah... that was it. I had somehow CONVINCED myself it was ulcers and got him in for scope (required for insurance to cover the meds/colics). It ended up being the right move for him. <br /><br />Honestly, after that, I started seriously looking at finding him a home that he would find less stressful. He was just unhappy being a competition horse, even without the ulcers. Now, he happily lives on a small, backyard barn with all the love and turnout he could hope for. Emily - May As Wellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12404536866220283931noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-54027892068165900502019-09-20T03:56:49.582-07:002019-09-20T03:56:49.582-07:00I had a pony in the yard who was just psychotic. T...I had a pony in the yard who was just psychotic. The most anxious, stressy, spooky animal I had ever seen in my life. Most days one could only work on a 20m circle at the gate. A year of work on the psychological side of things did help, but she was still borderline to ride and would spook badly EVERY ride, usually at nothing ("Champagne sees dead people" became a running joke lol). Then I had a light bulb at last and did an ulcer treatment. It was like flicking a switch. She now show jumps with confidence at shows! Firnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07805076661186739474noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-2153740800818044262019-09-19T12:54:50.484-07:002019-09-19T12:54:50.484-07:00So long, long ago, when I was but a teenager, we t...So long, long ago, when I was but a teenager, we thought my horse had ulcers. Back then, they didn't scope them regularly. It wasn't easy to get done, and usually involved a trip to the vet hospital. Not to mention very little was really known at that point about horses and ulcers. So we treated with Mylanta and Zantac. Back then, it cost $700 a month for that much zantac. Crazy. Anyway, long story short, we should have scoped because he didn't have ulcers, he had a giant stone in his intestines. None of this has anything to do with Charlie, my horse's symptoms involved regular episodes of mild colic. Not just hmmm could it be a thing type stuff. Just my experience with non ulcers I thought I'd share, even if you didn't actually ask...<br />But anyway, I never would have pegged Eros as an ulcer-y horse, but the body worker felt very strongly the other day that he has them. So we'll follow a similar course of treatment and see where we go! She is a vet as well, so I trust her opinions. And he has been kind of grumpy lately. <br />Hopefully Eros and Charlie are back to their happy slightly less lazy selves soon!Stacie Seidmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11421021003654717894noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-14446584102169117632019-09-19T11:53:48.994-07:002019-09-19T11:53:48.994-07:00Ulcer symptoms do seem to be somewhat individual t...Ulcer symptoms do seem to be somewhat individual to the horse and severity related, too, I'm sure. Bravo's eating habits don't change but he does get uncharacteristically spooky and he starts to get mean when made to work- biting, ear pinning, snaking his neck on the lunge line... etc. I've owned him for 7 months and treated twice- nexium and Abler pop rocks. Both times were for a full 30 days with a taper at the end. Both treatments seemed to have worked but I can't quite figure out how to get them to last. So I'm on a bit of trial and error to determine what environmental changes I need to try to make vs the efficacy of a gastric supplement of some type. We're trying SmartGI Ultra at the moment but I'm starting to see some spooky behavior again... It's been helpful to see what others are doing. Thanks for this post! Hope the tummy relief helps Charlie feel back to his old self!EquiNovicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17799583464228214025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-72917544269698922282019-09-19T10:52:10.299-07:002019-09-19T10:52:10.299-07:00I've never had Cupid scoped. His chiro always...I've never had Cupid scoped. His chiro always tests his "ulcer points" and doesn't get a reaction (though he is a touch girthy, especially on the right side), so I just do a preventative feed through. But I give Ulcergard if we travel, I think it smells like a cinnamon cookie and Cupid doesn't seem to object - as opposed to dewormer which he runs from!Training Cupidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14225857133948773885noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-8471126106882764702019-09-19T10:24:46.502-07:002019-09-19T10:24:46.502-07:00I'm with you on treating first, as it's ve...I'm with you on treating first, as it's very easy to do. I don't scope as between me & my vet, we know my horses well & can zero in on issues pretty accurately. A minor note that omeprazole is not effective for treating hind gut ulcers & can actually aggravate them. So if a horse is not responding to that & ulcers are suspected, that can be why. My memory is rusty bc I haven't had to deal with ulcers in a while, but as I recall ranitidine & sucralfate do hind guts. <br /><br />The reason Ulcerguard/Gastroguard (same thing) are so expensive is because they have a special coating that is required to allow the omeprazole to actually reach the site of the ulcers without being broken down by the digestive tract first. Without this coating, it's not physically possible for the chemical to persist long enough to get to the ulcer site, which is why a lot of cheap generics are a waste of money. I think (can't remember to be sure) that the UlcerGuard coating maybe expired recently, so there MAY be some generics that can now use that, but I'd check labels carefully to see if it's coated & manufactured with appropriate QA/QC.<br /><br />One preventative I do really really like that I have done my own "field" testing on is TractGuard -- it's not terribly expensive & is a really nice stomach buffer. It definitely makes a difference for Echo, as when I take him off of it, he'll soon start to get girthy. Put him back on the TractGuard & he's back to his normal happy self. eventer79https://www.blogger.com/profile/03160817772061132147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-91293871108229388272019-09-19T10:15:19.213-07:002019-09-19T10:15:19.213-07:00I had long wondered if Phantom had ulcers, mostly ...I had long wondered if Phantom had ulcers, mostly due to her (then) tension under saddle and propensity to ride up instead of down through a ride. One year I had her hocks injected, but she still continued to be sore in her back and girthy. I talked to the vet about the possibility of ulcers and she said omeprazole wouldn't hurt, so I tried her on it for a month.<br />At the end of the month, I had the most relaxed rides I think I'd ever had on her. I slowly tapered her off the omeprazole. And my old horse came back. So off to the vet clinic we went to get scoped. <br />And no ulcers were seen. <br />I went home with a course of Adequan instead. That fixed the back soreness/girthyness.Gray Flannel Horseshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10798379736435785129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-60152922837699460912019-09-19T10:15:16.013-07:002019-09-19T10:15:16.013-07:00Amber isn't an ulcery type of horse, either, b...Amber isn't an ulcery type of horse, either, but Whisper sure is. Ulcergard helped her a ton when my mom put her on it, and now that she's more confident and secure (thank you, Kahlua!) we're weaning her off of the ulcergard and putting her on a pelleted u-guard. She's been doing really well with this. For Amber I'd buy a tube of ulcergard before a show and start the 1/4 dose on a Thursday and continue through the show on Sunday, and that did seem to help her more than when I didn't do it. I also got a tub of pelleted u-guard when she had her surgery since she was on a lot of meds and she certainly looked uncomfortable. That helped for sure, but other than that I'm pretty lucky that Amber is so low-maintenance! lolMandyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14485570296592298816noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-24157473555006822202019-09-19T09:39:00.268-07:002019-09-19T09:39:00.268-07:00I LOVE those deli tubs. Obviously literally reusin...I LOVE those deli tubs. Obviously literally reusing them from the deli is best, but if anyone doesn't buy a lot of deli items, you can get a 50 count on Amazon for $13. We've found them nearly infinitely reusable for dry goods.Nicolehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13834098473974912416noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-49439416757336019272019-09-19T09:14:02.188-07:002019-09-19T09:14:02.188-07:00Your line "may you always feel smug and secur...Your line "may you always feel smug and secure in your convictions." I'm definitely filing away - it very much fall in line with the "may the odds be ever in your favor" Hunger Games quote. I see what you did there lolololL.Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05052638724440787772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-25163975272221169992019-09-19T08:41:10.976-07:002019-09-19T08:41:10.976-07:00I had a really interesting experience with this in...I had a really interesting experience with this in July.<br /><br />Zurich is an anxious, sensitive, emotional type horse. We also tick all the boxes for prime ulcer development. We ship out a lot - at least 2 or 3 times a month. Turnout is limited, he does not have hay in front of him 24/7.<br /><br />In July, even though he was fat and shiny, attacking his grain like he'd never eaten before, to really spooky and anxious under saddle - especially about jumping. This horse, who is a solid, proven 3' Hunter/Eq horse, started stopping. At stuff we had literally jumped 1,000 times. He got to the point where he was really anxious about jumping 18" crossrails with no filler. This was not my horse that eagerly takes me to the jumps with ears locked on.<br /><br />I actually thought it was his hocks (see fat, shiny, dappled-out horse with good appetite comment above.) Ulcers weren't even a consideration, or on my radar. I booked an appointment for my vet to see him. When she palpated him in his sternum/girth area, he almost dropped to the ground. We didn't scope (he's not insured, and we did decide to go ahead with hock injections), but I decided to give him a full 30 day treatment with Omeprazole paste.<br /><br />Literally the very FIRST DAY I gave him the paste, I had my horse back.<br /><br />Now, post-treatment, I take steps to ensure his stomach stays happy. He is on a SmartGut Ultra supplement. He gets alfalfa pellets + Outlast before every ride. He gets omeprazole paste the day before, day of, and day after we trailer. He gets good alfalfa hay *in* the trailer. I do my best to make sure I protect his stomach the best I can. Shaunahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17348396578251983461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-67998640874072201562019-09-19T07:20:49.202-07:002019-09-19T07:20:49.202-07:00Oh man, I was like "piffle, ulcers are not re...Oh man, I was like "piffle, ulcers are not real! Not for my horse!" for literally years with Candy. She was the opposite of Charlie - several physical symptoms, zero lifestyle stressors. I finally took my vet's advice and treated her with a powdered mix of omeprazole & rantinide (or however you spell it) for two months and she is like a completely different animal. I would not believe the changes if I hadn't seen them firsthand. <br /><br />At any rate, good luck with Charlie's treatment! Whether it's ulcers or not, I hope you find something that helps him feel his best again.Stephaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07140631127593549541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-24382203524142079582019-09-19T06:37:39.682-07:002019-09-19T06:37:39.682-07:00I totally agree with the first part of your post, ...I totally agree with the first part of your post, ulcers, saddle fit and teeth do seem to come up ALL the time! <br /><br />I've had multiple people suggest to me that I need to treat Kachina for ulcers, both professionals and armchair critics. She gets 24/7 turnout in a big paddock, 24/7 forage and zero grain which should reduce our risk but she does travel, is a horse who tends towards tension, and is girthy. So last spring I got her scoped, she was ulcer-free at that point (which was soon after a barn move) so that's a big indicator to me that her issues are not ulcer related and I have never treated for them.AutonomousDressagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10326654414307652910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-37595246359774533522019-09-19T06:34:06.553-07:002019-09-19T06:34:06.553-07:00I treated Eeyore a couple weeks after I got him si...I treated Eeyore a couple weeks after I got him since his life style changed so dramatically from stalled in a busy facility with horses everywhere to a small herd and out all the time. Not sure it was needed but I can get it through dusty and pretend I’m not spending money. Sarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03346020257901575574noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-77239002200793829052019-09-19T06:20:30.304-07:002019-09-19T06:20:30.304-07:00we might be moving spicy's field this weekend ...we might be moving spicy's field this weekend so thank you for reminding me to do something before I upheave his entire life and ruin it beyond recognition for moving him to a field he can SEE FROM HIS CURRENT FIELDPurple Meganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17179696153116063779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-80340414544054486532019-09-19T06:17:49.338-07:002019-09-19T06:17:49.338-07:00I think Spicy would not have ulcers if he were in ...I think Spicy would not have ulcers if he were in his field, and the same thing happened at the same time every day and he never went anywhere or got ridden or had his feathers ruffled.<br /><br />unfortunately that is not his life.<br /><br />If you decide you need something longer term I HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend U7. I still need to treat when I travel but as far as 'daily gut maintenance' it has made a HUGE difference. I say treat when I travel because usually a couple days after hauling he becomes a tit again, probably because when he trailers he just stares out the window refusing to eat and contemplating his own death.<br /><br />It's a good thing he's cute and I love him.<br /><br />Anyway, this is a really really great post.Purple Meganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17179696153116063779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-91460241646935010722019-09-19T06:05:40.861-07:002019-09-19T06:05:40.861-07:00When we first moved to WSS, the BO recommended Alb...When we first moved to WSS, the BO recommended Alber for Quest so we did an order of that. It likely helped in some way- though tbh there were so many changes to Quest's lifestyle in that short period of time that I'm not sure if the supplement or it was the fact that Quest LOVED being in a pasture board setup. I hope Charlie benefits from the extras! Grace Chttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14940229993479813381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-22808071776385066702019-09-19T05:50:09.594-07:002019-09-19T05:50:09.594-07:00So I'm a big proponent of nexium but this time...So I'm a big proponent of nexium but this time around I'm treating Subi's ulcers with Abler's paste. My issue was I didn't catch something was up right away and he went off his feed. So, Nexium is nice because you can toss it in feed, but if your horse isn't eating, it doesn't work. So, ulcergard was sort of off the table price wise for me (I mean, if I have to go that direction, I will, but I was trying to avoid it) but I was willing to try Abler's Abgard. Of course, but the time it showed up (they actually got it to me REALLY fast--4 days with the free shipping), the nexium had started to work and Subi had started eating again, but whatever... <br /><br />I've opted to do a full 30 days with Abgard this time around, but in the future, I have certain times a year that I'm going to put him on nexium as a preventative measure and see if I can stop ulcers in their track. With his vision issues and deteriorating eye sight (stupid cataracts), late summer is going to be an issue EVERY year so I have to be proactive. I think I'll be OK in the winter now that he knows and LOVES his stall, but I'll keep him on Purina Outlast and 2 flakes of alfalfa in his stall just in case. <br /><br />He does get Animed Ulc-R-Aid which appears to do nothing as a preventative. But, I have 2 unopened containers due to a shipping error and a replacement container so he's going to keep getting that because what else will I do with it? But, I do plan to stop it want I FINALLY run out. Sarah (threechestnuts)https://www.blogger.com/profile/17295039309380470750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-932439930694780998.post-59589930312602218192019-09-19T05:28:16.294-07:002019-09-19T05:28:16.294-07:00Have I told you that when I first got Mae off the ...Have I told you that when I first got Mae off the track that I ordered so much GastroGard that the territory rep for our geographic area reached out to me personally? Luckily we haven't needed it since that initial 3-4 month period but I do keep her on TractGard for maintenance. I've found it works well for Mae, it's cheaper than the other alternatives out there, and she hasn't had a flare up while she's been on it roothhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09670446457829193892noreply@blogger.com